汽车就如同相机、镜头、三脚架、音响...... 也是器材

要“客观”地对几件类似用途的器材进行对比，最好能做到都自费买下，都在役

如果自己买了A，别人买了B，论证A比B好，其实是论证“我的选择比你的好”

如果自己原先买了A，后来卖了A升级买了B，论证B比A好，其实是论证“我现在的选择比原先的好”

如果没掏自己的钱买A，然后反复批评A以及A的买家，其实是说“我的眼光比你的高明”

只有自己买下A又买下B，手头同时既有A又有B，同时用，那么基本会形成“A比B好在一二三，B比A好在四五六，各有各的优缺点”的看法

看一个人对器材的评判是否“客观公正”，上述条件提供了一个很好的角度。

他们说：决定食物味道的是厨师，炊具只起小作用

照片中仿佛飘出了糕饼的香气 ～～～

这个主题讨论“如何”（how）而不是“为何”（why）

当初发这个主题，就是感慨有些人明明是很强的主观偏见，却认为自己很客观很公正，于是来灌了这桶水

当下摄影的“利器”都是手机了…
传统的…被多数人鄙视了……

补充：但我个人还是喜欢胶片，
看不上那些几千万像素的手机…… 本帖最后由 蛮猴 于 2019-12-19 19:31 编辑

呵呵，再来枚非常少见的美能达早期镜头：W.Rokkor QE 35mm/F4

镜头好看

拍照还是要使用的，收藏我喜欢金属感的机器。比如 SRT

再上一张塑料感的机器，xg-m，接环CZJ50/2.8

x700机身完全是浓浓的塑料味，xd 充满了高级感，尤其是那取景器，双优不说了-当然，都是好机器

没说不喜欢XD系列。
我有2台XD系列的。但是实际使用上更多的是X700：轻巧，小手柄使用（基本不用速度优先）。XD系列最好要加装小手柄才能拿着更舒服。当然喜欢xd系列还有TA在美能达※※上的双优先功能，虽然我基本用全手动和光圈优先拍摄。

图片是其中一台。

XD7(s）应该明显好过X700，为什么不喜欢

好像我买车符合这个标准：最后的选择是我预算内的销量最大的几款里面找看着顺眼的，试驾都是走个过场。

“器材”应该能出作品，买了不用，不想用，用的不好，问题都出在人身上啊。

多试试就知道谁是样子货了。 本帖最后由 KNDETIE 于 2019-12-16 10:27 编辑

为何要“客观”评价器材？ 每个人发表自己的主观意见，参考别人的主观意见足矣。

Cameras Shouldn't Dictate Self-Esteem

相机如此，汽车何尝不是呢？
相机粉丝如此，汽车粉丝何尝不是呢？

引用如下

Cameras Shouldn't Dictate Self-Esteem

One thing that becomes obvious very quickly when reading various comments across the Internet (or in my In Box), is that there's a very large proportion of active participants that have linked their self-esteem to their camera brand (or model, or type).

Indicators of this are comments about how well a product is (or isn't selling) relative to others, the superiority of one approach to another, minor differences in some measurement, and so on.

We've been in a land of plenty for quite some time. I first wrote the "if you can't get good prints the maximum size of a desktop inkjet with any current camera it's not the camera that's at fault" comment over a decade ago. It's absolutely true today.

More often than not the "X is best" type of comments I see have nothing to do with actual picture results. Instead, they're attempts to justify a purchase, or a choice of model, or a brand choice.

I've been spending a lot of time lately working through my older images, trying to get my file system cleaned up and realigned, partly because I need to make it easier to find specific example images for a project I'm working on. In looking at all these older images—many from cameras whose output won't fill my 5K Retina iMac screen at 100%—I'm finding that my basic assessment of most older models was pretty much right on the money with the benefit of hindsight. I can see small differences that could impact how I use an image, particularly in the pre-2007 or so cameras.

For example, in the D70 line of Nikon's—D70, D70s, D80, D90, D7000, D7100, D7200, D7500—I can now clearly see that the D80 and the D7000 were the weak links (because of sensor and focus, respectively), while the D70, D90, and D7200 were the strongest contenders. (The D7500 is the current model, so almost by definition the strongest contender.)

Overall, though, I keep finding that many images I thought might not hold up because of lack of pixels or older sensor technologies actually do. Sure, I have to use noise reduction more aggressively on the old D80 images, and I have to find nuanced ways to sharpen the D1x images (the pixels weren't square), but I keep coming up with usable results.

But here's a doozy for you: running old Coolpix 995 JPEG images from 2001 through Topax JPEG to RAW AI and AI Gigapixel, I find that I can create really good looking images that fill that iMac 5K display from my original 3mp files (I've processed this image to look dark and gloomy, because on that early February day it was exactly that).

The biggest issue with the original pixels I used from that Coolpix was that there was significant chromatic aberration, which I've had to address in post processing. But surprisingly, the noise was easy to deal with, and even the near highlight blowout on the fountains was able to be pulled back. Acuity from that old built-in lens seems good once addressed with a deconvolution sharpener.

Do I want more pixels now that I have 45mp? Yes. I'd like to see us get another 15-20% step up, which would put us somewhere near 70mp in full frame.

Do I want more dynamic range? Yes. I'd love to have something near the theoretical limit (with non-spillover wells), which would put me near a two-stop gain from where my cameras currently are.

Do I want more acuity away from the center of my lenses? Absolutely. Working on an image that has excellent acuity corner to corner as opposed to only in a central region means that I don't tend to snip a bit of a crop here and there to avoid noticeable corner smear.

Do I want better ergonomics? Yes. Particularly with some brands, but I can find UX issues with virtually all the products these days.

But none of these things I just mentioned have anything at all to do with my own personal self-esteem. I actually don't care which camera or brand you purchase (or I use) as long as it's the correct decision for you (or me). I'm well aware that my choice may not be your choice, and vice versa. All those folk arguing on the Internet about "X is best" tend to not only ignore that, but most of the time they're making that argument to defend their choice. In other words, they don't hold their choice in high esteem in the first place.

We're in a world of excellent photographic tools these days. Proper technique and care in composing with virtually all the mid-range and up gear should net you fantastic photos. Never forget that.

Jun 9, 2019 at 8:42 AM

这题目回答结果是：难，太难。

首先评价人屁股正，其次要长期实践，大量使用各种器材，再其次他的需求是明确清晰，这些前提都能很好地做到估计也没几个人。
车也是一样。

灯光和明暗控制，很有感

摄影器材根本目的是拍照，因此只要快门准确，光圈收放准确到位就可以了。

胶卷时代，我主要用美能达相机，x700是最钟爱的，还有xd7和xg-m。尼康FA，FM2用得比较少，尼康的知名度很高，但是实际使用中缺少手柄，手握感不好，分量重。

数码时代是佳能30D很长时间，这部相机还在，用的比较少了。数码单反相机希望有一个轻巧的机身，较高的可用像数，比如1600iso有很强的实用性。快门连拍能达到每秒5张。其他都无所谓了。目前主要使用索尼的NEX6。数码相机之前使用佳能的G12，够用。

照片是胶片时代海鸥和腾龙70-210，乐凯400定胶卷。

够用为好。特殊情节除外。

原来这段话是滤镜兄的原创啊
我咋说在哪儿看到过几次呢

呵呵，滤镜兄开始挖帖子了。

冒泡还是潜水，这是一个问题。

汽车毕竟深度玩得不多。就自己玩过的不同类型的相机及其镜头的体验，反复印证着首贴的感悟。一是任何器材都各有风格、各有长短；二是任何器材都有一定的需求针对性，你之蜂蜜他之毒药。

任何一个（套）相机和镜头，很长时间不碰，再拿出来开拍，仿佛患了老年痴呆症一般，许多常用的功能一时找不到了，拍摄时那种人机合一的感觉也忽然失去了，需要好一阵子磨合才能找回一些当初磨合到最佳状态的感受。同时，换一种（套）器材，拍摄习惯有说不出的细微差异，成像风格也各有千秋，常常带来一些美好回忆和惊喜。

器材之争，既是很有趣的事，也是最无聊的事。—— 有趣还是无聊，其实不取决于器材本身的差异和长短，而取决于遇上的人。

呵呵，老兄，如果玩潜水，就不在这里玩了。外出挣点银子花也比潜水好啊。玩论坛浮出水面就是为了乐趣，潜水就没有意思了。
实际上，无忌的开办之初前几年，虽然不时出现争论，但大家基本上还是有事说事的，也尽量避免CN大战，还是讲究礼貌的；对于初学者的提问，也是有无数的热心者热衷于回答问题，受益匪浅。
即使出现争论的帖子，也不会像现在这样出口成脏，随时骂娘。比如这个帖子，俺个人感到就很有分量，虽然是争论的帖子并有少数帖子发言不当。
stevenmd实战对决SONY 717和OLYMPUS C5050ZOOM 。stevenmd真是打字速度高手，实在是佩服。
可目前，特别是最近几年，坛风日益下降，冷嘲热讽装疯卖傻的越来越多，客观的回答问题的越来越少。

解决之道：MT和AT各买一辆，轮换着开。

这样，既不会自己笑话自己弱智低能，也不会自己笑话自己穷酸了。

前段时间讨论AT和MT的问题，不少MT的拥趸就说AT的人是弱智、低能。

记得以前也和 kemmi 兄等一起探讨过怎样聊器材。kemmi 兄有句话，我印象很深：“不知道，不能乱说；知道了，更不能乱说”。

又要说，又不能乱说，确实很考人的。

我个人是不“鼓励”单纯低调玩潜水的。当然，像我这样“口水多过茶”也不太好。

也有例外

论坛里有棵泡菜有个帖子，节选如下：

是的
大家都容易唯心主义，因为我们坚持认为自己当初选择是最正确的。

应了一句话  实践才是检验真理的惟一标准

本帖最后由 大吃四方 于 2012-10-27 21:02 编辑

评论，也和修养及文化水平有关。
一般修养好和文化水平高的，都不会把自己的观点强加在别人头上的，其说话也总是加上：我自己的观点；就我个人看法，不一定正确；等等。

自己选择的东西, 肯定在购买之前进行了分析, 认为是最适合自己的.